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AP Consequences

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Re: AP Consequences

Post by PremierLeagueFan on 12/1/2015, 4:20 pm

finish1 wrote:Yes, but that argument can be made about the top team in just about any age group. In the scope of world football, the US is a giant rec league with lots of volume. Unfortunately, our rec league puts out a consistently poor product.

We need better players, not better teams. Our system needs to change from top to bottom and AP is a start. We also need the clubs to focus more on skill and developing players, not teams.

The teams with better quality create better players for the older age groups when and where it matters most. At this particular age group, team quality is a direct result of player quality and consistent coaching.

These few teams at the top play well becuase they are individually effective players that are unencumbered by the ball and are making the transition to group play and leadership on the pitch. They have a better development environment because the group has a consistent skill set and the level of internal challenge they put upon each other develops that higher level of performance.

Castro teams have gone so far as to have competition between two separately developed groups which ends up benefitting both. 

Odyssey has a strict level of quality borne out of the pace at which they move the ball and the decision making required by their attacking style of play.

This would not be possible outside of these teams because most of us are in a more forgiving team environment composed of many different players skill levels that we can hide behind.

I had a few parents tell me how surprised they were by the influence that a few of the Odyssey players had on their team and how they were able to raise the teams quality by pushing them to a higher pace and tempo.

I believe that is the ultimate goal of development which is to place similar BB's together to form more competition, but I also know that the idea is easier to discuss than to implement which is why I hope some teams can keep developing as a unit and be left intact until we reach more parity within our player pool.

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Re: AP Consequences

Post by finish1 on 12/1/2015, 5:03 pm

That is a perspective that permeates the broader soccer mentality, dreadfully flawed as it may be.

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Re: AP Consequences

Post by nearpost95 on 12/1/2015, 6:47 pm

North Texas should open up the free agency period beginning May 1 instead of the usual June 1 to help the upcoming chaos.

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Re: AP Consequences

Post by PremierLeagueFan on 12/1/2015, 6:55 pm

I wish there was a more concerted effort to consolidate players within the big clubs since they have the greatest number of talented players, but that would keep some teams in a constant state of flux and the majority of parents aren't ready to accept that type of system just yet.

The other reason it won't work is that there would have to be some type of coaching oversight and a selection committee with actual criteria for player transfers which would never be supported by the coaching staff unless it was mandated from the top. Big clubs like the Dallas Texans have a more adversarial style of management that pits their coaches against each other so there is no real incentive for a coach to develop a player and push him up the ranks to a higher level team.

This has been the status quo for so long that some clubs are now facing an existential threat because they have lots of talented players, but no winning teams and parents are increasingly looking towards alternative solutions from smaller clubs who have a clear mandate to develop players above all else.

There are so many Texans teams that have players who never get a chance to play in a game and yet they continue to load up their rosters while telling the parents that they know what's best. Club accountability would be an excellent way to resolve this isssue, but a lot of parents are so fooled by the marketing pitch that they refuse to hold the club accountable when they aren't getting results.
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Re: AP Consequences

Post by FrancoBaresi on 12/1/2015, 7:48 pm

So much speculation on what will eventually happen.  Everyone in this forum has great points.  I just hope CL listens and does the right thing.  They cannot make us all happy but hopefully it will be for the betterment of the kids and not to make the clubs richer.

The thought of a new league sounds appealing but if CL tweaks what they currently have this could be the perfect opportunity to make things better.

As for the BIG clubs, there are so many teams within the same age group, the clubs could realign them based on the birth years and still have plenty of teams.  This unfortunately would not be beneficial to the small clubs who only have 1 team per age group.  However in the free agency period there will be plenty of players looking for a "fresh" start too.

As mentioned earlier, start the free agency period May 1st and then have a QT for all age divisions would be fair to all teams/clubs.  We all play in summer tournaments anyway so just stay home and enjoy what unfolds.  No byes for anyone.

Then  have a promotion/relegation period after the Fall 2016 to try and level the playing field sooner than later.  Then resort back to the current promotion/relegation system the following year.

Just my 2 cents worth.
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Re: AP Consequences

Post by CCM on 12/1/2015, 9:46 pm

In other words with QT, to heck with where you place this year in your division. It's going to be new teams and new divisions, so what does it ultimately matter. Those rules for certain % of team required to participate in invitational tournaments (such as our qualifying for ESPN Copa in Orlando) is now gone since our team is about 50/50. The more I think about this whole thing, the more I am just fed up.

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Re: AP Consequences

Post by SoloJonz on 12/1/2015, 10:04 pm

if you are truly 'fed up' wth the prospect of your 01/02 BB team's chances of being invited to the ESPN Copa tournament becasie of this, you have much bigger problems than what the AP consequences actually present...

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Re: AP Consequences

Post by CCM on 12/1/2015, 10:15 pm

SoloJonz wrote:if you are truly 'fed up' wth the prospect of your 01/02 BB team's chances of being invited to the ESPN Copa tournament becasie of this, you have much bigger problems than what the AP consequences actually present...

Dude.  I have mentioned a ton more reasons earlier.  No reason to belabor those.  This is just yet another kick in the crotch for our team that I hadn't contemplated yet.  The trip to Orlando was going to be a fun experience for us.  Now we won't meet the requirements as our team (which has already qualified/received the invite) will be split up.

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Re: AP Consequences

Post by hanallalone on 12/2/2015, 6:44 am

Copa ESPN fed us that line last year, and even said that we could play in Silver (and almost guarantee a trip to Florida) although they knew we we had no business in that bracket... We declined the Silver offer because we wanted to play where we belonged, and because the Florida trip was OVER a year away... Never understood ESPN and that policy, but our experience was that it is a 2nd rate tourney... Sucks that your team is getting the shaft, but from ESPN I wouldn't have expected anything more than an expensive trip that ultimately disappoints you due to the tourney policies and procedures... This AP thing is ripping through like a hurricane and we're all stuck in its path...
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Re: AP Consequences

Post by PremierLeagueFan on 12/2/2015, 7:15 am

Copa ESPN and Disney are well organized soccer holidays with big points in the GotSoccer ranking boards.....end of story.

FC Premier is a good NTX team and coach Forzi gets excellent player and team results so congratulations to you for winning ESPN Copa Dallas and qualifying for the National Tournament.

All Soccer Holiday tournaments are meant to be a fun time so I wonder if you could get some clarification on the Age Pure requirements because your roster mix is very common and I would imagine that other teams who have qualified for Orlando will be in the same predicament. COPA ESPN should allow the qualifying teams to remain intact for this next event.

You might even find that ESPN has some kind of age pure exemption or a one time clause that grandfathers a mixed roster into the tournament so best wishes to you and your effort to get your "entire" team to Orlando.
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Re: AP Consequences

Post by hanallalone on 12/2/2015, 8:28 am

Once again, that sucks that you won and this change could potentially mess up the trip... ESPN (my personal experience) was not NEAR what we expected in many ways from a tourney with such a big name... It would be a shame to have the spot and then be robbed of it. so best of luck to you... Hopefully they will make some sort of grandfather clause that will allow teams to participate... What a mess...
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Re: AP Consequences

Post by CCM on 12/2/2015, 8:55 am

Team Forzi? We're actuallyLiverpool Owen. But regardless, who knows? It's a mess and I don't expect it to get any better anytime soon unfortunately. Hope I am wrong.

Have a good day!

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Re: AP Consequences

Post by SnookumsConCarne on 12/2/2015, 9:15 am

CCM wrote:Team Forzi? We're actuallyLiverpool Owen.  But regardless, who knows?  It's a mess and I don't expect it to get any better anytime soon unfortunately.  Hope I am wrong.

Have a good day!

LP Owen. Forzi.
I keep getting those 2 teams mixed up also.
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Re: AP Consequences

Post by PremierLeagueFan on 12/2/2015, 1:14 pm

CCM wrote:Team Forzi? We're actuallyLiverpool Owen.  But regardless, who knows?  It's a mess and I don't expect it to get any better anytime soon unfortunately.  Hope I am wrong.

Have a good day!

I was looking at the U13 bracket and it shows Forzi as the winner of Dallas ESPN Copa 2015. Regardless, the point still holds and I hope you work it out and enjoy the national tournament invite that you earned.

https://events.gotsport.com/events/results.aspx?EventID=46246&Gender=Boys&Age=13
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Re: AP Consequences

Post by CCM on 12/3/2015, 11:12 am

Thanks!

Yea.. We qualified last fall (Nov 2014) but they told us for the 2016 tournament. Crazy long time between qualifier and the Aug tournament. Almost 2 yrs!

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Re: AP Consequences

Post by hanallalone on 12/3/2015, 12:24 pm

Plus that tourney was a weekend of cold, windy, and wet... You should get the trip just for enduring that tourney; it was icy and flat out miserable... I remember an icy Sunday at the Andromeda fields...
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Re: AP Consequences

Post by CCM on 12/3/2015, 12:33 pm

Yes. MISERABLE! That's what ultimately made me go out and buy a portable propane heater!

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Re: AP Consequences

Post by SnookumsConCarne on 12/3/2015, 1:21 pm

CCM wrote:Yes. MISERABLE!  That's what ultimately made me go out and buy a portable propane heater!

Propane Heater?
Sir. You need to toughen up and endure this cold weather.
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Re: AP Consequences

Post by CCM on 12/3/2015, 3:06 pm

SnookumsConCarne wrote:
CCM wrote:Yes. MISERABLE!  That's what ultimately made me go out and buy a portable propane heater!

Propane Heater?
Sir. You need to toughen up and endure this cold weather.

Be careful or I'll post that pic of you in the biohazard looking outfit you had at last tournament. No rules about posting parents pics is there?

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Re: AP Consequences

Post by SnookumsConCarne on 12/3/2015, 6:16 pm

CCM wrote:
SnookumsConCarne wrote:
CCM wrote:Yes. MISERABLE!  That's what ultimately made me go out and buy a portable propane heater!

Propane Heater?
Sir. You need to toughen up and endure this cold weather.

Be careful or I'll post that pic of you in the biohazard looking outfit you had at last tournament.  No rules about posting parents pics is there?  

Call it what you want. But that sleeping bag jumpsuit was warm as heck.
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Re: AP Consequences

Post by futbolista on 12/4/2015, 12:49 pm

SnookumsConCarne wrote:
CCM wrote:
SnookumsConCarne wrote:
CCM wrote:Yes. MISERABLE!  That's what ultimately made me go out and buy a portable propane heater!

Propane Heater?
Sir. You need to toughen up and endure this cold weather.

Be careful or I'll post that pic of you in the biohazard looking outfit you had at last tournament.  No rules about posting parents pics is there?  

Call it what you want. But that sleeping bag jumpsuit was warm as heck.

CCM please post the pic of ChiliConCarne. That would make my day.
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Re: AP Consequences

Post by SnookumsConCarne on 12/4/2015, 1:14 pm

futbolista wrote:
SnookumsConCarne wrote:
CCM wrote:
SnookumsConCarne wrote:
CCM wrote:Yes. MISERABLE!  That's what ultimately made me go out and buy a portable propane heater!

Propane Heater?
Sir. You need to toughen up and endure this cold weather.

Be careful or I'll post that pic of you in the biohazard looking outfit you had at last tournament.  No rules about posting parents pics is there?  

Call it what you want. But that sleeping bag jumpsuit was warm as heck.

CCM please post the pic of ChiliConCarne. That would make my day.

Wow.... Now you've gotten "HIM" started.

Hey! FootballLizard, did Copa Rayados give you guys a partial refund on the cancelled games?
Thank goodness the Bobby Rhine tourney was cancelled on time.
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Re: AP Consequences

Post by futbolista on 12/4/2015, 1:39 pm

No Señor. The team will get a 50% discount if we decide to play in next year's tournament.
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Re: AP Consequences

Post by finish1 on 12/4/2015, 2:23 pm

That's fair. Our local tournaments should take note.
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Re: AP Consequences

Post by hanallalone on 12/4/2015, 8:21 pm

The email from Copa Rayados said that you get a 50% discount on the next tournament played in the United States... They have those tournaments in a few other states... The next one will probably be elsewhere... Ugh!
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Re: AP Consequences

Post by SnookumsConCarne on 12/5/2015, 7:29 am

futbolista wrote:No Señor. The team will get a 50% discount if we decide to play in next year's tournament.

But half of your team will be '01 pure next Fall.
So which team will get the discount next year?
Someone's gonna get porked.
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Re: AP Consequences

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