Was having a conversation with my brother in law about my 8 years old club soccer and academy teams and coaches, and he thought I was crazy.

He played D1 college soccer and grew up playing select in the Dallas area. He noted that he played rec. for his Dad's team until U11 and felt we have bought into the overhyped soccer culture of getting them into the club scene too early. His teams were always D11 classic league teams and he felt there is no need to get serious about soccer until they go select. He played on travel teams and went to numerous all star camps and that is how he got noticed. He thinks there is so much soccer to be played from age 14 to 18 that starting with tournaments and club practices, skills practices etc at 8 is foolhardy.


Does he have a point? I tend to think so, but at the same time often succumb to the pressure that my kid surely has to play on a good club in order to not fall behind. What if all our kids simply played Rec until they go select. Would it change their develpoment much?

My about to be U16 did exactly that. Rec until U11. Now going into his 6th year as club captain, playing D1 CL, ODP regional player, 1st team all district frosh and soph so far. What they need to do at earlier ages is fall in love with the sport not work hard on their skill set. Agree 100% with your bro-in-law.

The mythical rec player who goes on to become a classic sensation is like the unicorn often talked about never seen except in anecdotes....

anselansel wrote:The mythical rec player who goes on to become a classic sensation is like the unicorn often talked about never seen except in anecdotes....

As is the mythical academy player who goes on to play at ANY college.

I know this subject gets beat into the ground; but for the most part (obviously there are exceptions) if your present day BB loves soccer and wants to improve his skills and understanding of the game they have to be with a club. Vast majority of U8 rec players I have seen in ASA and PSA are there because Mom/Dad want them to participate in a team sport so they can yell "GO TIMMY!!!"

So many posters on here make club seem so unenjoyable. Did ya'll have to drag your kids out to the fields everytime? Mine hasn't been in 3 weeks and he is biting at the bit to get back.

my2cents wrote:My about to be U16 did exactly that. Rec until U11. Now going into his 6th year as club captain, playing D1 CL, ODP regional player, 1st team all district frosh and soph so far. What they need to do at earlier ages is fall in love with the sport not work hard on their skill set. Agree 100% with your bro-in-law.

Kids like this are the exception and not the rule. Starting academy at 7 or 8 may seem early, but I think it does benefit getting in earlier. There is (hopefully) better coaching at academy, or at least more experienced. There is often a more athletic and gifted and COMMITTED group of players as opposed to Rec. And the competition is much more challenging than almost any Rec team your BB can play. I guess the bottom line is what your child wants out of soccer. If it is just fun with friends, win/lose it's ok, and they aren't looking to be challenged, then Rec is the place. If you identify a competitive spirit that wants and NEEDS better competition and teammates, Academy is a no-brainer. My bb played Rec and Academy side by side, so he got to see the differences first hand, as was better suited to make a decision about where to play. He chose select at U11, and was blessed to play on a top d-1 team in Classic this past season.

It's all about what the kids want from the sport, but many parents, including myself at times, make the decisions. Once I started letting my son make the choices whether I agreed with him or not, we both became much happier about soccer. Just my own opinion and experience. Your kiddo just needs to have fun, no matter what, 'cause if he isn't, it will present itself sooner or later.

"As is the mythical academy player who goes on to play at ANY college."

lol, you forgot to say on full scholarship also

WRG wrote:Was having a conversation with my brother in law about my 8 years old club soccer and academy teams and coaches, and he thought I was crazy.

He played D1 college soccer and grew up playing select in the Dallas area. He noted that he played rec. for his Dad's team until U11 and felt we have bought into the overhyped soccer culture of getting them into the club scene too early. His teams were always D11 classic league teams and he felt there is no need to get serious about soccer until they go select. He played on travel teams and went to numerous all star camps and that is how he got noticed. He thinks there is so much soccer to be played from age 14 to 18 that starting with tournaments and club practices, skills practices etc at 8 is foolhardy.


Does he have a point? I tend to think so, but at the same time often succumb to the pressure that my kid surely has to play on a good club in order to not fall behind. What if all our kids simply played Rec until they go select. Would it change their develpoment much?

I think it has less to do with the level you play (rec vs. academy vs. skills vs. indoor vs. futsal) and more about the mental approach the player (read: family) takes in those early years.

IMO there is nothing wrong with academy soccer per se, it's more about running around to 4 different club practices each week and 4 different games on the weekends.

I agree with someone else saying the younger ages are where they should develop a love for the game. Package that with a focus on technical development in a place where the kids are treated fairly and you'll be fine. If that's rec, so be it. If it's academy with Club X, fine.

jimulon6 wrote:

my2cents wrote:My about to be U16 did exactly that. Rec until U11. Now going into his 6th year as club captain, playing D1 CL, ODP regional player, 1st team all district frosh and soph so far. What they need to do at earlier ages is fall in love with the sport not work hard on their skill set. Agree 100% with your bro-in-law.

Kids like this are the exception and not the rule. Starting academy at 7 or 8 may seem early, but I think it does benefit getting in earlier. There is (hopefully) better coaching at academy, or at least more experienced. There is often a more athletic and gifted and COMMITTED group of players as opposed to Rec. And the competition is much more challenging than almost any Rec team your BB can play. I guess the bottom line is what your child wants out of soccer. If it is just fun with friends, win/lose it's ok, and they aren't looking to be challenged, then Rec is the place. If you identify a competitive spirit that wants and NEEDS better competition and teammates, Academy is a no-brainer. My bb played Rec and Academy side by side, so he got to see the differences first hand, as was better suited to make a decision about where to play. He chose select at U11, and was blessed to play on a top d-1 team in Classic this past season.

It's all about what the kids want from the sport, but many parents, including myself at times, make the decisions. Once I started letting my son make the choices whether I agreed with him or not, we both became much happier about soccer. Just my own opinion and experience. Your kiddo just needs to have fun, no matter what, 'cause if he isn't, it will present itself sooner or later.

Totally agree with that statement! I came to the same conclusion a year ago.

My brother in laws thought was the same that many of you have said. Let him play rec for awhile or if you think he must find a club, find one that has a coach he loves. Don't put too much pressure on him but let him develope a love for the game.

Then at age 15 or 16 he can seek out the best playing opportunity he can find. If that means the ball breaker coach that doesn't suffer mistakes, it is up to the kid to decide who he wants to play for.

Makes sense.

jstply wrote:

jimulon6 wrote:

my2cents wrote:My about to be U16 did exactly that. Rec until U11. Now going into his 6th year as club captain, playing D1 CL, ODP regional player, 1st team all district frosh and soph so far. What they need to do at earlier ages is fall in love with the sport not work hard on their skill set. Agree 100% with your bro-in-law.

Kids like this are the exception and not the rule. Starting academy at 7 or 8 may seem early, but I think it does benefit getting in earlier. There is (hopefully) better coaching at academy, or at least more experienced. There is often a more athletic and gifted and COMMITTED group of players as opposed to Rec. And the competition is much more challenging than almost any Rec team your BB can play. I guess the bottom line is what your child wants out of soccer. If it is just fun with friends, win/lose it's ok, and they aren't looking to be challenged, then Rec is the place. If you identify a competitive spirit that wants and NEEDS better competition and teammates, Academy is a no-brainer. My bb played Rec and Academy side by side, so he got to see the differences first hand, as was better suited to make a decision about where to play. He chose select at U11, and was blessed to play on a top d-1 team in Classic this past season.

It's all about what the kids want from the sport, but many parents, including myself at times, make the decisions. Once I started letting my son make the choices whether I agreed with him or not, we both became much happier about soccer. Just my own opinion and experience. Your kiddo just needs to have fun, no matter what, 'cause if he isn't, it will present itself sooner or later.

Totally agree with that statement! I came to the same conclusion a year ago.

Just arrived there myself this June. Time to let bb enjoy the game and be where he wants to be with kids he wants to be around and a coach that he enjoys playing for. I think there is a lot of pressure placed on kids around here to be on the best team at all costs. I worry about burnout from the pressure as evidenced by all the postings on this site as well as stories I have heard for years. BB has a ton of passion for the game, and I don't want him to lose it.

My mistake was buying into all the hype, agreeing to drive 100 miles round trip for practice, emphasizing winning over everything else, assuming it was important to my son to be on a top team. Clearly it was more important to me. And those choices nearly killed bb's soccer spirit. Those were MY mistakes, not my bb's. I do get a little comfort in knowing that, based on some responses here, I wasn't the only parent struggling with these aspects of competitive sports. My son plays multiple sports, and the problem with parents, and coaches, is rampant. I had to grow up before my son could be where he was happy to be, not vice versa.

This is like therapy!

I think if I had it to do all over again I would not have had my son playing so much indoor during all of the off-seasons the last couple of years. The good thing for me is my son is an '01 so I have a chance to rectify that situation right now before he becomes burnt out. I am lucky to now have a coach for my son that tends to work him very hard and be tough on him but also encourages the team to actually take a break from soccer during the winter and part of the summer. We have had other coaches in the past that begged us and tried to coerce us into playing indoor. Thinking back on it I am fairly certain this wasn't about improving my son or the team but more keeping the team together so they wouldn't stray to other clubs. I was more naive back then but have my eyes wide open now. So we are not doing any indoor this summer and this winter we will not be as well.

my2cents wrote:My about to be U16 did exactly that. Rec until U11. Now going into his 6th year as club captain, playing D1 CL, ODP regional player, 1st team all district frosh and soph so far. What they need to do at earlier ages is fall in love with the sport not work hard on their skill set. Agree 100% with your bro-in-law.

My oldest is also a 96 boy and take my word for it, it was much easier to stay in rec until U11 yet still make a D1 team back then than it is now. Academy soccer was just starting. When my 96 was a U8, SDL was in its first season for boys (they had a girls league one year earlier). PAL started a year later when he was U9. There wasn't much club presence. There were a lot of independent teams and a lot of of the club teams had dads as coaches. Clubs hadn't realized that youth academy soccer can be a money maker.

Now, in every league I see, there are club teams as young as 5 and 6. I see young teams coached by established coaches some of which have coached select teams (That's not always a good thing but that's a topic for another day). Most of these kids are getting much better coaching than rec kids and most of them would easily beat out a rec kid for a spot once they get to U11.

That doesn't mean the Academy route is better. It just means it will probably take most players a couple of extra years to get to a top tier team if you skip academy soccer.

Me, I hedge my bets. I have my kids play Academy at U7 but I don't take them out of rec until U9 or U10.

:That doesn't mean the Academy route is better. It just means it will probably take most players a couple of extra years to get to a top tier team if you skip academy soccer."

frankly that is crap, academy is far superior to rec. which is why many stud rec kids are bewildered when they join academy teams and find that most of the kids are just as good as they are or better. You skip out of academy and competitive playing that long and think you are going to waltz onto a top d1 team, you are dreaming......

jimulon6 wrote:My mistake was buying into all the hype, agreeing to drive 100 miles round trip for practice, emphasizing winning over everything else, assuming it was important to my son to be on a top team. Clearly it was more important to me. And those choices nearly killed bb's soccer spirit. Those were MY mistakes, not my bb's. I do get a little comfort in knowing that, based on some responses here, I wasn't the only parent struggling with these aspects of competitive sports. My son plays multiple sports, and the problem with parents, and coaches, is rampant. I had to grow up before my son could be where he was happy to be, not vice versa.

This is like therapy!

Our situation was slightly different in that I didn't know how early kids started academy soccer. We live outside the soccer hub that is Dallas/North of Dallas and therefore were not in the know. I was under the impression everyone played rec until u10 THEN went looking for an academy team. Boys was I surprised to find out some of these kids had been playing academy for several years! At first I was concerned that my bb was "behind" the other boys but over time I realized he was as good and better in some areas then the veteran academy kids. Don't get me wrong he was/is still behind is some aspects compared to some of the studs out there but his future is looking pretty good. I need to mention as well that a change of teams, outside skills sessions, and my bb's own motivation to do his own skills about 30 minutes daily has helped as well. Knowing what I know now I am not sure what path I will take with my youngest dd. I may put her in academy but since I coached my bb until he went academy I may wait until she is 7 or 8. It is very refreshing to read some of these posts, there is a genuine concern for the bb's longterm love of the sport and development as well. Good for you!

anselansel wrote::That doesn't mean the Academy route is better. It just means it will probably take most players a couple of extra years to get to a top tier team if you skip academy soccer."

frankly that is crap, academy is far superior to rec. which is why many stud rec kids are bewildered when they join academy teams and find that most of the kids are just as good as they are or better. You skip out of academy and competitive playing that long and think you are going to waltz onto a top d1 team, you are dreaming......

And that statement is crap. My bb played rec up until U11, jumped straight to a top D1 team, and was starting with full game playing time mid way through the fall season. So don't think it can't happen. It depends on the kid, their skill level, their passion for the sport, and some of what they are taught while in rec. Don't get me wrong, I do know that academy teams have much better more experienced coaches than your local dad/coach you will get with rec. But if the player has the desire, they will pick up whatever they may have missed out on.

And that statement is crap. My bb played rec up until U11, jumped straight to a top D1 team, and was starting with full game playing time mid way through the fall season.




by the way, my post was directed to the people who think you can do that at 14 or 15. but i still doubt you...

anselansel wrote::That doesn't mean the Academy route is better. It just means it will probably take most players a couple of extra years to get to a top tier team if you skip academy soccer."

frankly that is crap, academy is far superior to rec. which is why many stud rec kids are bewildered when they join academy teams and find that most of the kids are just as good as they are or better. You skip out of academy and competitive playing that long and think you are going to waltz onto a top d1 team, you are dreaming......

And then two years into select the academy players' parents are bewildered when the stud rec kids decide to get serious blow by their kid. The top athletes who are serious about the sport will rise to the top. Starting seriuos training at U11 gives a kid four years before he is even in HS. By U14 U15 where you started really does not matter if you have a coach that developes players and a player that is committed.

And then two years into select the academy players' parents are bewildered when the stud rec kids decide to get serious blow by their kid


i think i saw a unicorn too....

I had great advice early, just find a good coach. if your kid connects, that's half the battle. let them have fun. we're in a day camp put on by a great coach and they're tired when i pick'm up but they had a blast. let's not take the fun out. famous words from a local manager come to mind "he do what he do."

mlittle89 wrote:I had great advice early, just find a good coach. if your kid connects, that's half the battle. let them have fun. we're in a day camp put on by a great coach and they're tired when i pick'm up but they had a blast. let's not take the fun out. famous words from a local manager come to mind "he do what he do."

If you follow the kid and not direct him - the right thing will often result.

I do think, given the earlier ages of academy, that the skill level gets vastly better each year - so, naturally, the kids will be behind sooner and sooner. But, I do think a gifted athlete with drive can get there in about 3 years. It's not rocket science (that takes 5 years, fyi).

Didn't anyone watch Bend it Like Beckham or Kicking and Screaming - that type of dedication does wonders in as little as 90 minutes?

anselansel wrote:And then two years into select the academy players' parents are bewildered when the stud rec kids decide to get serious blow by their kid


i think i saw a unicorn too....

Must have been at an academy practice learning soccer stud 101

WRG wrote:Was having a conversation with my brother in law about my 8 years old club soccer and academy teams and coaches, and he thought I was crazy.

He played D1 college soccer and grew up playing select in the Dallas area. He noted that he played rec. for his Dad's team until U11 and felt we have bought into the overhyped soccer culture of getting them into the club scene too early. ... He thinks there is so much soccer to be played from age 14 to 18 that starting with tournaments and club practices, skills practices etc at 8 is foolhardy.

The single point is all about too early for what is effectively select U8 soccer with year round multiple weekly practice, tourneys, etc. I agree. My biggest concern is that we have let the coaches and clubs take this over and it has and will continue to morph if we allow them this level of control over our kids.

Kids need time off between sports, kids need to try other sports, and kids need to be kids. The current kiddy academy approach is a mirror of what U11 and up select is, and that's far too much commitment towards a single endeavor at such a young age IMO.

Someone has to say the words that no one wants to hear. If you think your kid is going to get an athletic scholarship to some college based on soccer, you are very likely deluding yourself. If you think your kid is going to be playing MLS at some point in his life, you are almost certainly deluding yourself. And even if he does play MLS, he would probably make more money working full time at Costco.

If you are expecting anything other than trying to develop character and athleticism in the kid, then you are probably wasting your time and money. If you are expecting anything other than some fun on the weekend and a great game of soccer, then you are probably wasting your time and money.

Again, sorry to be pessimistic, but you have to keep it real. So many of us here have drunk the Kool-Aid and never question or double-think anything that we are asked to do. We spend so much money, invest so much time, drive our kids all over the nation and to what end? I have a feeling most of us are going to look back in 15 years and say what in the world were we doing? Your kids are not going to be kids for forever. Spend time with them doing kid things. As Yak Attack said above, and let them be kids.

Go do the research on Google. The numbers are not hard to find. start with this http://www.ncaa.org/wps/wcm/connect/public/ncaa/issues/recruiting/probability+of+going+pro

"Someone has to say the words that no one wants to hear. If you think your kid is going to get an athletic scholarship to some college based on soccer, you are very likely deluding yourself."

You know, I have heard this enough to feel like I just have to speak up here.

First of all, at the very great risk of sounding like an idiot here, let me just say that I actually call into question how pertinent this link is with reference to what we are talking about here. I don't think you can necessarily extrapolate numbers that are clearly referring to recruiting from high school and apply them to club soccer. Colleges, especially in NTX, generally don't recruit from high school, they recruit from clubs. Some kids do go the high school route to college, especially in many states where club soccer isn't nearly as strong as it is here in NXT, or California, Florida, Illinois, etc., to name a few.

Secondly, let me just say that in the last many years I have seen many, many boys and girls make the leap from club to college soccer. Last year in particular, I personally saw more than 2/3 of one '92 boys club team matriculate from their club to college soccer, most with at least partial scholarships. Now, they certainly are not all playing at Duke and USC, but many of these colleges were truly amazing, private colleges, playing in very competitive divisions, albeit "lower."

That team was top of D2 but had played D3 most of their years.

Having said that, most probably don't realize how important the coach is in all of this. Many coaches are far too lazy to go to bat for your child and get him $$ for college, but there are a few who excel at this aspect of coaching. If that is your goal, seek them out. I just think it is totally unnecessary to keep telling people that getting $$ for college through NTX soccer is some sort of pipe dream.

bunited wrote:"Someone has to say the words that no one wants to hear. If you think your kid is going to get an athletic scholarship to some college based on soccer, you are very likely deluding yourself."

You know, I have heard this enough to feel like I just have to speak up here.

First of all, at the very great risk of sounding like an idiot here, let me just say that I actually call into question how pertinent this link is with reference to what we are talking about here. I don't think you can necessarily extrapolate numbers that are clearly referring to recruiting from high school and apply them to club soccer. Colleges, especially in NTX, generally don't recruit from high school, they recruit from clubs. Some kids do go the high school route to college, especially in many states where club soccer isn't nearly as strong as it is here in NXT, or California, Florida, Illinois, etc., to name a few.

Secondly, let me just say that in the last many years I have seen many, many boys and girls make the leap from club to college soccer. Last year in particular, I personally saw more than 2/3 of one '92 boys club team matriculate from their club to college soccer, most with at least partial scholarships. Now, they certainly are not all playing at Duke and USC, but many of these colleges were truly amazing, private colleges, playing in very competitive divisions, albeit "lower."

That team was top of D2 but had played D3 most of their years.

Having said that, most probably don't realize how important the coach is in all of this. Many coaches are far too lazy to go to bat for your child and get him $$ for college, but there are a few who excel at this aspect of coaching. If that is your goal, seek them out. I just think it is totally unnecessary to keep telling people that getting $$ for college through NTX soccer is some sort of pipe dream.

I thought the discussion was around U8 players? The number of players eventually getting scholarships or even playing in college is an extremely small percentage of those playing at U8. Even high school would be a vast minority. Obviously, the percentages rise exponentially at U17+ when it comes to Classic League and is probably close to 80-100% when it comes to Developmental Academy at U18.

What some people call a dream killer, others call reality - some prove the naysayers incorrect, kudos for them - but for every college player or national team player - there are lots who didn't cut-it, many with no other plan or expectation in life.

Agreed, Clue. If referring to U8, I would certainly concur that many, many of these boys will not be playing at U11, let alone U17. But for those who invest -- in good grades and hard work on the field, including sometimes over-the-top commitment by parents -- this is an attainable goal. Pun intended.

I'm just sayin' ...

I agree and I would never discourage anyone from doing anything. Just keep your expectations real and keep them in tune with the ability of your soccer player. I am the first to admit that I have done lots of stuff related to soccer that most non-soccer people think is completely absurd, yet here I am doing it and will continue to do it for as long as the kid wants to do it. This is the "thing" that we've chosen to do with the kids and it's what we do for fun. If we weren't doing soccer we would be doing something else like skiing or BMX biking or hockey or geography bees or fiddle contests or whatever it might be.

I see a lot of people doing this who don't seem like they're having a lot of fun, and that is a concern to me.