http://www.socceramerica.com/article/42928/learning-from-mexico-the-distant-neighbor.html

This guy gets it, Oscar Pareja & FCD get it, I've been preaching this for years.
When is the USSF going to get it?

Fabiano9 wrote:http://www.socceramerica.com/article/42928/learning-from-mexico-the-distant-neighbor.html

This guy gets it, Oscar Pareja & FCD get it, I've been preaching this for years.
When is the USSF going to get it?

Of course if everything is related to Mexico or Mexicans, it is going to be right .

As much as I hate to admit it, the proof is in the pudding.
U17 World Champs twice in the last four years, Gold Cup champs twice in the last three years.
Professional league dominance in region for who knows, like 70 years.
One of the 10 best professional players in the world right now, starting on one of the top two teams in the world (ManU).

What does the US have to show????? Women Soccer, that's it. Sprinkled in with an occasional bigtime Mens victory.

If you cant beat them, copy them, i say.

Fabiano9 wrote:As much as I hate to admit it, the proof is in the pudding.
U17 World Champs twice in the last four years, Gold Cup champs twice in the last three years.
Professional league dominance in region for who knows, like 70 years.
One of the 10 best professional players in the world right now, starting on one of the top two teams in the world (ManU).

What does the US have to show????? Women Soccer, that's it. Sprinkled in with an occasional bigtime Mens victory.

If you cant beat them, copy them, i say.

Mexico is ahead of us and playing better than we are, no doubt but that being said:

The Mexican Mens National Team has had VERY little success on the worlds biggest stages. If we are going to copy someone that has a more technical style, let's copy Brazil or Spain. Even the Netherlands. Brazil has been consistently good and Spain are the current champs. Why copy a program that typically doesn't get much further than we do in the World Cup?

The point of the article is that there are a s-load of youth latino soccer players in this country who are being overlooked by our system. These are for the most part, technical players who could benefit MLS or the national team in the future. If there were hundreds of thousands of dutch or brasilian players here, then go for it, snatch em up.

How are these players being "overlooked"??? I have yet to see a kid come to a tryout that is talented or gifted and told that he cannot play because he does not have enough money. Every coach or club seems to find a way. Now if you are talking about a completely subsidized system then you are really going to start overlooking players because the number of teams will go down.

NTskeptic wrote:How are these players being "overlooked"??? I have yet to see a kid come to a tryout that is talented or gifted and told that he cannot play because he does not have enough money. Every coach or club seems to find a way. Now if you are talking about a completely subsidized system then you are really going to start overlooking players because the number of teams will go down.

The fact is that for every talented latino that comes to a big club tryout, there are another s-load just as good as him (or better)that don't come because the perception that they will not be able to play because of the money. You can't scholarship every single one of them. Look at the latino leagues and you will see some pretty amazing untapped talent. Don't try to pretend that our pay for play system is not the most f'd up system in the world.

How many latinos were there on the Gold Cup team???? Bocanegra and Bornstein's sorry half Mexican/Jewish ass. That's it. and we got our asses handed to us by Mexico. It was a freaking embarrassment, in the worst way. How is it in a country where probably 40-50% of its soccer playing youth are latino, that there are only 1 1/2 latinos on the national team? Because our system is f'd up, and you know it.

Oscar Pareja for USSF President!

UNBELIEVABLE-------"sorry half Mexican/Jewish ass"----------YOU HAVE DEFINED YOURSELF FABLANO.

Fabiano9 wrote:

NTskeptic wrote:How are these players being "overlooked"??? I have yet to see a kid come to a tryout that is talented or gifted and told that he cannot play because he does not have enough money. Every coach or club seems to find a way. Now if you are talking about a completely subsidized system then you are really going to start overlooking players because the number of teams will go down.

The fact is that for every talented latino that comes to a big club tryout, there are another s-load just as good as him (or better)that don't come because the perception that they will not be able to play because of the money. You can't scholarship every single one of them. Look at the latino leagues and you will see some pretty amazing untapped talent. Don't try to pretend that our pay for play system is not the most f'd up system in the world.

How many latinos were there on the Gold Cup team???? Bocanegra and Bornstein's sorry half Mexican/Jewish ass. That's it. and we got our asses handed to us by Mexico. It was a freaking embarrassment, in the worst way. How is it in a country where probably 40-50% of its soccer playing youth are latino, that there are only 1 1/2 latinos on the national team? Because our system is f'd up, and you know it.

Did you forget Bedoya and Agudelo both latinos and possibly Altidore if you consider Hatians latinos.

Fabiano9 wrote:The fact is that for every talented latino that comes to a big club tryout, there are another s-load just as good as him (or better)that don't come because the perception that they will not be able to play because of the money. You can't scholarship every single one of them. Look at the latino leagues and you will see some pretty amazing untapped talent. Don't try to pretend that our pay for play system is not the most f'd up system in the world.

There probably is some truth to the statement that some disenfranchised superstars are never discovered because their parents think they can't afford it. I don't have any great suggestions there. But I guarantee you with 100% certainty that if a superstar goes to any club tryout, he will play. If he doesn't have any money, the club will find a way.

You really can't generalize too much in terms of ethnicity. But I do think there are a few barriers keeping some players out of the loop.
1. Not all parents want their kid spending a lot of time playing soccer. Some would prefer their 15 yr+ son to be working. Very common.
2. The drive is difficult especially when parents work late. Not every teen has their own car. If there are soccer fields next to Dart locations, I would like to know about them, please.
3. Communication. Not everyone knows about tryouts and the process of club soccer.
4. Not everyone is accepting of the poor. The cliques sometimes run off a few.

If USSF wanted to reach more kids, they could contact United Way and start club teams at Boys and Girls Clubs. They could also begin to reach out to High School programs instead of making them feel that they serve no valuable purpose. I have seen many state caliber HS teams that could give an academy team a decent game.

The club system isn't as inclusive as it could be. In reality though, bills have to be paid. We have what we have.

Its funny that he is not talking about the Mexican style- He is talking about Mexican Players.



Interesting enough- head of US soccer is Columbian, Oscar P. is Columbian, Wilmer C. is Columbian.

See a trend.

Whats even more interesting is that FC Dallas is trying to incorporate the DUTCH style. Not South American style

personally I think mexican soccer is garbage but hey doing better than us I guess. However I think a more telling sign is the number of players who played on the U17 or U20 national teams that came from here. They certianly did better than the US team so the question is why did we not manage to keep that talent here? Mexico is currently raiding the US latino talent pool because it is being underserved at the national level.

[quote="go99"]personally I think mexican soccer is garbage but hey doing better than us...quote]


So what does that make US soccer?

adopting a country's 'style' is a ridiculous concept. our biggest problem is that many 'would-be' top soccer players never play soccer because their parents urge them to try basketball or football--never mind the fact that they'll only grow to be 5'10'' and 160lbs. . .

until we have a solid generation of dads who grew up with, and cherish soccer--we will be deficient on our national potential. we've got boys who 'waste' their individual athletic potential focusing their time on sports that they will NEVER play at a level beyond high school. other countries simply do not have the sports distractions that we have.

NTskeptic wrote:UNBELIEVABLE-------"sorry half Mexican/Jewish ass"----------YOU HAVE DEFINED YOURSELF FABLANO.

Not so much a rip on his sorry ass being Mexican/Jewish as it is that he's not very good.

mrclean wrote:You really can't generalize too much in terms of ethnicity. But I do think there are a few barriers keeping some players out of the loop.
1. Not all parents want their kid spending a lot of time playing soccer. Some would prefer their 15 yr+ son to be working. Very common.
2. The drive is difficult especially when parents work late. Not every teen has their own car. If there are soccer fields next to Dart locations, I would like to know about them, please.
3. Communication. Not everyone knows about tryouts and the process of club soccer.
4. Not everyone is accepting of the poor. The cliques sometimes run off a few.

If USSF wanted to reach more kids, they could contact United Way and start club teams at Boys and Girls Clubs. They could also begin to reach out to High School programs instead of making them feel that they serve no valuable purpose. I have seen many state caliber HS teams that could give an academy team a decent game.

The club system isn't as inclusive as it could be. In reality though, bills have to be paid. We have what we have.

I hear ya, brotha.

DragonStryker wrote:

go99 wrote:personally I think mexican soccer is garbage but hey doing better than us I guess. However I think a more telling sign is the number of players who played on the U17 or U20 national teams that came from here. They certianly did better than the US team so the question is why did we not manage to keep that talent here? Mexico is currently raiding the US latino talent pool because it is being underserved at the national level.

Actually, what this would say is that we are properly developing players contrary to the opinion of many on this board. What we arent developing is national pride in the players being trained here.

But that's a far larger political argument as to why thats the case that isn't even remotely appropriate for a board dedicated to discussing young soccer here in the US.

Well some of the issue is that some of these players are not being offered the opportunity to play on the US national team while mexico welcomes them with open arms.

Actually, what this would say is that we are properly developing players contrary to the opinion of many on this board. What we arent developing is national pride in the players being trained here.

You actually think these US Latino players are learning from the US model? Those kids are learning on their own while playing pick up games in the hood. That's why they are technically superior, more touches on the ball. And a lot of those touches are in non-structured settings, where their imagination flows. US soccer has nothing to do with their development.
And the reason some of thes kids are NOT getting the invites to US national camps is b/c US soccer does not know talent. Creativity is not important to US soccer... size and speed are the top priorities.

soccermom040 wrote:Actually, what this would say is that we are properly developing players contrary to the opinion of many on this board. What we arent developing is national pride in the players being trained here.

You actually think these US Latino players are learning from the US model? Those kids are learning on their own while playing pick up games in the hood. That's why they are technically superior, more touches on the ball. And a lot of those touches are in non-structured settings, where their imagination flows. US soccer has nothing to do with their development.
And the reason some of thes kids are NOT getting the invites to US national camps is b/c US soccer does not know talent. Creativity is not important to US soccer... size and speed are the top priorities.

This.

soccermom040 wrote:Actually, what this would say is that we are properly developing players contrary to the opinion of many on this board. What we arent developing is national pride in the players being trained here.

You actually think these US Latino players are learning from the US model? Those kids are learning on their own while playing pick up games in the hood. That's why they are technically superior, more touches on the ball. And a lot of those touches are in non-structured settings, where their imagination flows. US soccer has nothing to do with their development.
And the reason some of thes kids are NOT getting the invites to US national camps is b/c US soccer does not know talent. Creativity is not important to US soccer... size and speed are the top priorities.

Agree 100%. There isn't much that soccer organizations can do to raise the bar IMO. The biggest problem is that most American kids spend more time indoors these days. I would love to see more areas in neighborhoods devoted to small sided pick up games. You don't need a FIFA size field. Just a spot for some 3v3 would be great. Many of our recent immigrants begin to spend more time with TV and videogames as well. It's hard for a soccer ball to compete with a nice AC and XBox live. Technical skills come with time on the ball. Given the variety of sports/interests that our kids have it's hard to count on a daily pickup game of 3v3.

It's her last statement that hits the nail on the head. We as a soccer nation are not focused enough on Technical Development at a young age and are focused too much on wins. We focus on Size and Speed because at young ages size and speed wins games. We go 11 v 11 too soon amongst a host of other things.

I posted this in another thread but if you watched us play in the U17 World Cup size and speed are not the problem. Athleticism is not the problem. First Touch, Technical Skills, Lack of Creativity were the problem.

This is why I only slightly agree with the earlier post that said it is because of other sports taking our athletes. I mean there is no denying we would be better. Yeah as much as I like Tim Howard who wouldn't love to have seen Lebron James choose soccer and fill up the goal? Who wouldn't love to have seen Deion Sanders playing RM for the USMNT?

But here is where I split with that view: 1st off our population is so great that we have plenty of soccer first athletes. As many or more than many of the countries that are better than us. 2nd I have sat there and listened to other countries coaches being interviewed and they say that we are tough, athletic, fast and physical. Notice none of those coaches ever comment positively on our technical skills? 3rd, again when watching the U17 World Cup I watched us get pounded by Germany. It was 4-0 but it could have been much worse and as I sat there I never wished for faster or bigger athletes. I wished for players that had a decent first touch. I wished for players that could pass the ball effectively to their teammates feet. We had a wing that could get by his man quite often but the pass was either poor, or more often than not the first touch as he recvd. the ball was so poor he had to come back to it and by then the defense would catch up to him. Yes we definitely need more kids to fall in love with this great sport and stick with it. But we need to take the kids we DO have and some how get them technically even with the rest of the world.

Just finished watching U.S. lose to Japan in the WWC.

Interesting stat: The country of Japan currently has 25,000 registered female youth soccer players. The State of California has 200,000.

I think USSF is overlooking Japanese/American soccer players in the US.

FGFF wrote:It's her last statement that hits the nail on the head. We as a soccer nation are not focused enough on Technical Development at a young age and are focused too much on wins. We focus on Size and Speed because at young ages size and speed wins games. We go 11 v 11 too soon amongst a host of other things.

I posted this in another thread but if you watched us play in the U17 World Cup size and speed are not the problem. Athleticism is not the problem. First Touch, Technical Skills, Lack of Creativity were the problem.

This is why I only slightly agree with the earlier post that said it is because of other sports taking our athletes. I mean there is no denying we would be better. Yeah as much as I like Tim Howard who wouldn't love to have seen Lebron James choose soccer and fill up the goal? Who wouldn't love to have seen Deion Sanders playing RM for the USMNT?

But here is where I split with that view: 1st off our population is so great that we have plenty of soccer first athletes. As many or more than many of the countries that are better than us. 2nd I have sat there and listened to other countries coaches being interviewed and they say that we are tough, athletic, fast and physical. Notice none of those coaches ever comment positively on our technical skills? 3rd, again when watching the U17 World Cup I watched us get pounded by Germany. It was 4-0 but it could have been much worse and as I sat there I never wished for faster or bigger athletes. I wished for players that had a decent first touch. I wished for players that could pass the ball effectively to their teammates feet. We had a wing that could get by his man quite often but the pass was either poor, or more often than not the first touch as he recvd. the ball was so poor he had to come back to it and by then the defense would catch up to him. Yes we definitely need more kids to fall in love with this great sport and stick with it. But we need to take the kids we DO have and some how get them technically even with the rest of the world.

It is not that we don't have soccer first athletes, it is that the best athletes in America are not soccer first athletes. How many top Mexican athletes are lost to football, basketball, or even baseball? I know there are a few. Eduardo Nájera, Fernando Valenzuela, Mark Sanchez, Tony Romo, ...etc . How many does Germany lose? Dirk Nowitzki and Boris Becker. Only two to other sports in 30 years. Ok, I am kind of kidding, but you get the point.